Looks like the Services want to replace the M9

[Little Jack]

1911. Because that's what all the "operators" are using.... wait.

This thing is going to need to fit comfortably in the hands of a 5' 110lb E-4 and be controllable. The biggest round isn't worth anything if you can't handle the firearm safely and effectively. I'll take shot placement over bigger hole any day. Biggest problem with the 9mm is having to use ball ammo. That's why I always aim for the face.

I can't see the military adopting something for general issue that comes with X number of backstraps/sidestraps etc. The theory is sound but execution would be a pain.

I see another multi month T&E that ends up with some cool options that are better than what they've got now but not enough so that they'll dump their current pistol.

I'm interested to see some pics of what the industry provides.

 

[Dan1612]

Yes, Para started it. I LOVE the grip on the double stacks, but until Wilson makes mags for them, I'll pass. To me, the FNX is the next best thing. Even if it is plastic.

 

[donr101395]

True, but Uncle Sam likes a thumb safety.

Like these they did from the factory for the Tasmanian police?

 

[helo_hunter]

Double stacks just don't fit a lot of shooters - main complaint I have with the Glock. Which is why I mentioned the XDm.....

Love my single stack 1911s and the Marine Corp has gone that route aleady.

 

[Dan1612]

Like these they did from the factory for the Tasmanian police?

True, and I hear you can fix the grip angle on gen 4's.

 

[donr101395]

True, and I hear you can fix the grip angle on gen 4's.

What I've found on grip angle is that it's familiarity. I regularly switch between Glock, 1911, BHP, revolvers etc. and it's fine, but if I haven't shot one of them for a few months it takes me a couple of hours to get back into the swing. If I go a few months without touching a Glock it will point up for me the first few presentations, if I don't touch a 1911 for a few months after using only Glocks, the 1911 will point slightly down for the first few presentations. Grip angle is an excuse to not like something someone isn't fond of and not much more. The sights are in the same place on all of them and they all line up the same way. :banplease:

 

[Little Jack]

What I've found on grip angle is that it's familiarity. I regularly switch between Glock, 1911, BHP, revolvers etc. and it's fine, but if I haven't shot one of them for a few months it takes me a couple of hours to get back into the swing. If I go a few months without touching a Glock it will point up for me the first few presentations, if I don't touch a 1911 for a few months after using only Glocks, the 1911 will point slightly down for the first few presentations. Grip angle is an excuse to not like something someone isn't fond of and not much more. The sights are in the same place on all of them and they all line up the same way. :banplease:

BAN!!! that's makes too much sense and is far too reasonable a thought.

Double stacks just don't fit a lot of shooters - main complaint I have with the Glock. Which is why I mentioned the XDm.....

Love my single stack 1911s and the Marine Corp has gone that route aleady.

The marines bought 4000 as the initial buy. Contract calls for up to 12000. That's far from a general issue siderarm.

 

[D B Cooper]

Sig P229 in .40 S/W , or P227 .45 ACP. Of course, a .22LR in the eye will stop them too. The Military needs get away from the 9mm.

 

[FrankT]

It has been shown that many LEOS and Military cannot keep a 40 or 45 on target through an entire mag in a combat situation where they can keep a 9MM directly on target. I would say change the ammo and stop blaming the caliber, that is the real problem. I agree those that can keep a 45 on target should be allowed to have them but a one size fits all is the wrong way to go.

 

[Stagman]

How about a concealed carry rifle. FN 5.7

 

[Stagman]

 

[Burnt Drag]

I vote for a combo ray-gun/water-pistol....

 

[Dan1612]

5.7 would zip right through the mountain monkeys, leaving a 22 cal hole. Not ideal. Very cool though.

 

[Snow Bird]

You know I wonder how much hand guns are even used in combat? I would venture to say many,many more rounds are shot at paper in the mil than are ever shot in combat..

I have yet to see a handgun used in a fire fight on any vids I have seen. More, Can I burn the barrel out on this rifle in this fire fight. At handgun ranges how many times would even the best shot try to empty a full mag into the bad guy anyway. All that talk about 15 rounds into a bad guy is just bullshit anyway.

I really doubt they have been used much since entering tunnels in South East Aisa. Maybe some with combat experance in the real world instead of a computer key board can change my mind and not from some report written by who knows who. And that person can tell me how many bad guys were killed with a hand gun that haden't already been shot.

Granted special forces may have a use for them but the rest of the time they are probally just weight being carried around that would be better served carrying a few extra mags for which long gun you happen to have.

 

[Stagman]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i89cMnfxXy0
45-70 Derringer LOL

 

[Dan1612]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i89cMnfxXy0
45-70 Derringer LOL

What a wuss. Lol.

 

[Clay]

You know I wonder how much hand guns are even used in combat? I would venture to say many,many more rounds are shot at paper in the mil than are ever shot in combat..

I have yet to see a handgun used in a fire fight on any vids I have seen. More, Can I burn the barrel out on this rifle in this fire fight. At handgun ranges how many times would even the best shot try to empty a full mag into the bad guy anyway. All that talk about 15 rounds into a bad guy is just bullshit anyway.

I really doubt they have been used much since entering tunnels in South East Aisa. Maybe some with combat experance in the real world instead of a computer key board can change my mind and not from some report written by who knows who. And that person can tell me how many bad guys were killed with a hand gun that haden't already been shot.

Granted special forces may have a use for them but the rest of the time they are probally just weight being carried around that would be better served carrying a few extra mags for which long gun you happen to have.

Read Inside Delta Force by Eric Haney, your thoughts on military pistol use will change.

I have no military experience, but my understanding is they are used a lot by breech teams and in CQC situations. To this day, Delta relies on it primarily when taking an aircraft and in similarly tight environments.

 

[Snow Bird]

Clay I will try to read it but that is what I said, Special forces,Not the usual grunt.

 

[Rastus]

True, but Uncle Sam likes a thumb safety.

Which is silly because they teach us no different than responsible weapon handlers do: don't put your finger on the trigger until you are ready to fire. I feel that trigger safety mechanisms have great potential for the military

 

[Ric-san]

You know I wonder how much hand guns are even used in combat? I would venture to say many,many more rounds are shot at paper in the mil than are ever shot in combat..

I have yet to see a handgun used in a fire fight on any vids I have seen. More, Can I burn the barrel out on this rifle in this fire fight. At handgun ranges how many times would even the best shot try to empty a full mag into the bad guy anyway. All that talk about 15 rounds into a bad guy is just bullshit anyway.

I really doubt they have been used much since entering tunnels in South East Asia. Maybe some with combat experience in the real world instead of a computer key board can change my mind and not from some report written by who knows who. And that person can tell me how many bad guys were killed with a hand gun that hadn't already been shot.

Granted special forces may have a use for them but the rest of the time they are probably just weight being carried around that would be better served carrying a few extra mags for which long gun you happen to have.

Welcome to the jungle there Snow Bird...tell the above statement to then 1st Sgt Kasal...